Seashore
/ by Matt
We’ve had a bit of a problem to solve over the last weeks, to do with texture painting on the Macs here. GIMP is one of the few open source image editors available on Mac OS X, and it works pretty well, but with one major issue – it doesn’t support tablet pressure sensitivity, which is vital for texture painting. GIMP is based on the GTK+ toolkit, which has not yet been ported to run on Mac OS X natively, so GIMP uses Apple’s open source implementation of X11, which does not pass tablet events through to applications.
We got in touch with some GIMP developers, who were quite helpful, giving us ideas of how to proceed, with a developer contact at Wacom sharing some hints as well. Unfortunately all the options (hacking GIMP, or X11, or paying a developer to work on a proper Mac OS X version of GTK+) were not very nice, leaving us without much luck. I then remembered a post on drunkenblog mentioning a little open source Mac application called Seashore.
Seashore takes the GIMP core and wraps it up in a lovely native Mac (Cocoa) user interface, and to our joy, it supports tablet sensitivity. It uses the GIMP native .XCF file format which is great – we can run both applications side by side, using Seashore for painting and if we need any extra filters or functionality that’s in GIMP, it’s just a quick save and reload away. Seashore is really early in development, and strangely enough the GIMP developers didn’t seem to know about it at all.
The code is in CVS at sourceforge, it seems pretty clean, and the filter/plug-in system seems pretty good too. There are a couple of other features that we’d like extended, such as having the tablet pressure affect size as well as opacity, which hasn’t been implemented yet. If there are any Cocoa-savvy programmers out here that would like to help us out in our mission to improve open source graphics software in production, here’s how you can get eternal fame, glory, and a warm fuzzy feeling inside :)
« Now its feeling like a movie! | Title and Script News »
First of all, excited I observe this blog and the whole project and I’m a big fan, but I’m confused a little bit, I thought the orange exclusively work with opensource software, but MAC OS X isn’t?
And the audio stuff? …will be made with opensource or not?
Thanks for reply!
Good luck and good ideas ;-)
Jarod
I think I forgive you all for using Max OS X.
Hate to say: I use windows XP. I am to stupide for working fast on linux,I think.:)
Sorry I ask, but is there someone how knows something like Seashore for Windows XP.
I am looking for stuff to get the tablet pressure sensitivity working with Gimp for a long time, but still nothing!
Good you all have seashore now!!!
Jarod, I think Ton’s comment at the bottom of this page explains it well, please read it:
/blog/equipping-the-studio#comments
We never said that we’d work with exclusively open source software for every bit on the hard drive, because that’s almost impossible (think closed source linux graphics drivers) and it’s not the point of this exercise. Apart from of course providing the final product as open content, the aim is to develop and improve open source graphics software by using it in a production environment in the real world – we aren’t going to be coding drivers or OSes here. We already have a bunch of Linux machines that we are using and testing in this way, maybe we will have a Sun box too. None of the things we do or the formats we use will be Mac only, (or Linux only for that matter). I personally think what we’re going through here is precisely part of our aims – practically testing these sort of things in the real world. People in the real world use Macs, so how can we find ways to promote and improve open source graphics software for them.
Reno, sorry I can’t help you here, we aren’t using Windows at all. From all I’ve heard GIMP pressure sensitivity works ok on there, but that’s all I know.
Cheers,
Matt
Thanks, now it is clear! ;-)
I overlooked Ton’s comment, sorry…
Jarod
Hello!
This a very interesting blog, I’ve been browsing through the whole site from the beggining.
As to the question GIMP/WindowsXP/TabletPressure, with the 2.2x generation of the GIMP, there is absolutely no problem for WACOMs
I hope this helps.
Orange team : go! go! go!
Dani
Hi !
Hey ! I didn’t know about Seashore and I will test it as soon as I can ;) Maybe if you let Seashore developers know about the fact that the Orange project is using their software, they can implement the functionnalities you need…
Keep up the good work !
Seashore the mac verison of gimp.
Nice. Just like NeoOffice is the Mac version of OpenOffice.
Gimp developer have verry little thought about Codoa.
There is another work around in the works that sould fix the problem. Ie Gtk for Mac. Port Gtk will not just port gimp.
Dears,
it is really great what you are doing in Orange projects. I have just purchased DVD in matter.
All should emphasise that your work is to to improve not only the Blender application but consequently all significant open graphic software.
I have recently fully abandon using Maya and fully focus on my steps in Blender. We all believe that Orange project will produce not only awesome CG film but mainly absolutely revolution new version of Blender. Also brand new Manual would be appreciated as the actual one is already quite dated in some aspects.
Thank you very much once more.
Keep up your attitude (and don not forget to blog as often as possible :-).
Jiri
Hi!
For OSX & Win there is Free but NOT open sourse ArtRage:
_http://www.ambientdesign.com/artrage.html
Pressure sensitive, but NO layers.
Good luck!
THANK`S Matt and Dani.
Think my problem is the brand of my tablet.
Strange,in P.S. it works. AAAAHH:(
If it comes to only painting in gimp you could as well use linux, but I suppose that you do other stuff on Mac OS X not mentioned here.
I’m very very disappointed on seeing that all the Texturing will be done using Apple Stuff. I was thinking that this was an opensource project to develop free tools like Blender, but now i see that this project it’s fully sponsered by Apple.
@ Jerry:
I don’t think that’s a crime like Matt already said.
Most of the OpenSource Windows applications are developed with MS Tools.
And if people like you donate more money, they would not even require external sponsorship.
Jerry, I don’t see why you are so riled up, or why you need to keep posting this.
Apple gave us much needed discounts on hardware for two of our six workstations, the others being Linux based. We are not using any Apple graphics software, only the OS, and you obviously don’t paint textures with an OS. Seashore is an open source application that’s based on GIMP. This doesn’t have anything to do with Blender, and as you can see by the enormous amount of work that Ton has already put into Blender development for the purpose of this project, your comment doesn’t make any sense. Please take a minute to calm down before bringing these non-issues up in our posts.
Cheers,
Matt
No way a discounted Apple system is cheaper than a comparable Linux PC. (Of course it wouldn’t be as sexy.) It’s only cheap publicity for Apple. You indeed don’t paint textures with the OS. So it doesn’t matter. But that’s the point: if it doesn’t matter, why not choose an open source OS. So, don’t be surprised if people might feel disappointed in your choice for Apple for an Open Source Movie project. You could have expected this.
But actually, I personally don’t care. It feels like vegetarians fighting with veganists. So don’t be bothered, just make a good movie.
Jerry, don’t worry, there’s no big problem. Our total workstation count is 2 macs and 4 linux workstations- we’re far from being an “apple only” house. All the *production* software is indeed opensource: blender (primarily) gimp, seashore, etc. and the file formats are openable by anyone on any OS with crossplatform software. We aren’t sponsored by apple, but there was a significant discount on the macs.
Texture painting will happen on both linux and macs: we all have gimp with tablets ( we brought our own ). As Matt pointed out not even all the software on the linux machines is opensource: the nvidia openGL drivers are a big exception.
It might seem that the macs got more blog time, but that’s only because of this issue with pressure sensitivity. You’ll see plenty more linux related posts in the near future.
If anyone of you guys have found a way to make pressure-sensitive tablets (eg. wacom or Ascom etc..)
then please “please” include information how you guys
did this on a LINUX platform.
I too work with Linux (no windows at all, linux exclusively)
but the tablet issue (no matter how many howtoo’s I`ve read)
keeps coming up as I cant get it to work with the Gimp.
Again – thanks for keeping the blogs informative and
useful to the public!
You shouldn’t be too puristic about the operating system. In my opinion it’s great that Blender has always been available for so many platforms – and I think Blender will profit from the fact that different systems are used by the Orange team.
Don’t forget that many users will learn from the Orange team’s workflow experiences as well…
When it comes to wacom Everything You Always Wanted to Know About It under Linux (and even FreeBSD)is on the page http://linuxwacom.sourceforge.net, documentation, howto… If you seek for advice try to look there. Unfortunatly I don’t have yet a wacom (looking to it), but when comes to pressure-sensitive under gimp-linux it’s probably the only way. Personally don’t have anything against Apple, kinda like it even, everybody knows that is open-source friendly. You have their boxes with OS packed so use it well.
JoOngle: Pressure sensitivity in Linux is not that big a problem. I have downloaded the linuxwacom.sf.net drivers for my Graphire2, did some fiddling around, and it worked. In short:
Configured the standard way, X looks for /dev/mice or so. All mice are mapped to this device, to make hotplugging mice easy. This is not what you want when you want pressure sensitivity. So you have to remove it, and make separate entries for the different mouses on your system. Like this:
http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-mini/Wacom-USB-mini-HOWTO.html#ss6.2
Restart X. Then with Gimp, select your device at File -> Preferences -> Input devices -> Configure extended input devices.
I remember having troubles compiling the driver or so, but I don’t remember details about it.
If anyone has questions, feel free to send an e-m@il to rtwolf at gmx dot net (that’s me)
I wonder why this is such a problem on Macs then, if other software does support it.
Nierozwazny & Ronald Teune,
Thank you for your most valuable input on the issue.
It contains pretty much what I’ve read before, but there
are some new stuff I’ll look into. Thanks :)
Since I’ve switched to Linux permanently (Bold move), and
used Linux for over 8 years now (still an infant…really!)
I’ve got to solve this issue. These days almost everything,
if not everything…works in Linux, I miss nothing…except
from the Tablet suppport…so I’ve gotta solve this issue
even if it takes me for the rest of my natural life.
Regards,
JoOngle (Tommy Helgevold)
Ronald Teune, the problem was that GTK (the Gimp toolkit) only works on X11 on Mac OS X, and Apple’s current X11 lacks XInput support, which is used for the pressure sensitivity. As reported in Matt’s original post that started this thread, we got around it by using a new Mac fork of Gimp that uses the native UI libs. We still use normal Gimp on other operating systems of course, and also on macs for the features that Seashore still lacks.
Today we actually noticed in Apple’s X11 notes that XInput support is in their TODO, mentioning Maya as one app. that needs it.
~Toni
Hi,
at the first time I have to note, that first Jiri’s comment wasn’t mine. It seems, that there are more then one Jiri in the World ;-). I have to agree with Matt. It isn’t bad to use Mac Os X for orange project (btw: darwin is open source, isn’t).
Matt: did you try any Linux for PPC (for example Ubuntu). Some live distro could be half/temporary solution in this situation too.
Best regards.
Jiri
I hope you guys don’t take it wrongly, but I’m happy to see you stumble upon things like these ;)
Not that I wouldn’t want the project succeed. Quite contrary.
The more rough edges you’ll find, the more will a motivated bunch like you will fix or work around and blog about! Yay for project Orange!
JoOngle –
you slacker :) I think you’ll have a better chance of getting it working if you switch to a mainstream distro instead of slackware. You might try an Ubuntu live CD and see if that works for you…
LetterRip
Hi Tom,
I’d hate to switch again. Slackware is the distro I’ve been
using for a YEAR now – never before have I used a distro
for such a long time, as an earlier Mandrake, SuSe, Knoppix etc. etc..user I can safely say… Slack is for me. 99 % of the things just work…I have everything I need..In fact..I only lack Wacom-support….that’s it..
But what a nightmare it is to get wacom to work… heck…I’ve
been working since the last post in this blog-thread straight
And that’s a LOT of time by now….and nothing has changed.
I’ve not been able to change from version 1.30 (kernels own wacom support) to the min. 1.40 current version… Even followed the step-by-step wacom project guide 3-times-over, and still…nothing changes…no errors….but no support either.
It’s a certifiable nightmare!
I don’t agree that it’s not open just because it could, in theory, be more open.
No need to be confussed, all user software used is opensource.
A fuzzy line is drawn at os level. So opensource software; yes, opensource o.s.; most, opensource bios; none.
That’s how I understand it.
Thanks to nitpicking some hardcore “open” people don’t see this project as open but as common license. (sorry for my english).
But in this case the door is opening so, even half open is open.
I guess some discription of open is; done by an unpaid (virtual) community. Alot of software projects are made that way. But most succesfull projects are not, they are just to hard to organize. And there is another important difference between making a movie and making software (if you pardon my french:) Movie makers try to deliver a finisched project, (opensource) software creators more and more rely on the next release.
The whole issue of extending storytelling is yet to be discoverd, and mind you, made very possible with this project.
It’s very easy to stand on the sideline and point the finger to the part in this production that is not shared at the moment of creation. It’s yet to be determent what the advantage of that is anyway.
That’s all not very important. Once the organisation of this project gets solid then that will leave a great basis to build upon.
btw. I must yet see pixar release files I can render, or animators writting blogs about their crappy director (sorry bassam, not you). I call that a closed door.
Now if this Orange is a succes, I can imagine projects like this will get even more open, just as blender slowly becomes more open. But it is open by itself, regardless of tools used to make it open.
My 2c
@Matt: Please excuse me if i seemed too strong with my words, but now i want to take place the issue in a softly way. I like a lot your Organge project, and i think also many other people. I understand the words of Ton regard to the fact that it seems impossible to use only opensource things and/or without a brand in the real world, but to buy and to use Applestuff in your project is a different choice, IMHO. That’s beacuse Apple it’s not like Microsoft or Intel, is not only Software or only Hardware, Apple do all these things, from the OS to the HW box. You can buy workstations of whichever brand, but then over this box you could put whichever software inside. With a Mac, and in fact this article of the blog demonstrates it, you always use X11 and/or his OS, so not only the Gimp, and a lot of software produced by Apple, and it make some (IMHO, a lot) publicity to Apple. I think that you must make a more transparency effort, because all the people that will buy your DVD to finance this great project (like me, IE), will be also making/finance some kind of the publicity to Apple. People had to know that maybe Apple will be your sponsor and that you will use mainly of his software/hardware due to this fact; and in this case i think (i talk only for me) that don’t want to finance your (beautiful) project. The same thing, i think, is interesting for many other people/financers that will donate and/or will buy your DVD, they must know if they finace also a publicity for Apple. What i say is not only related to Apple but for any brand involved or any sponsor, obviously.
I hope not to have offense neither or annoyed nobody, and however i‘m always a fan of this fantastic project and all you guys.
:-)))
@Bassam Quote:” It might seem that the macs got more blog time, but that’s only because of this issue with pressure sensitivity. You’ll see plenty more linux related posts in the near future.”
Thank you a lot for this clarification, Bassam. I’d like to explain that my objection is not exactly an Opensource vs commercial software, or Linux is better then any other OS…There are millions of these religion wars on the net, and absolutely i don’t want to feed here these kind of stupid wars.
Of course is not possibile to be 100% with opensource software, but the problem that i have noticed is concerned about the sposorship and the public donation of the project. If you guys uses Applestuff, this is a very big advertising for a big brand like Apple, and i think people must know if there is some strong sponsorship. The challenge of this project, i think, is also to find a way to avoid using also full hardware branded system, otherwise you can, IE, make some corrections for the final movie with Discreet’s Inferno, but i think it’s not so coherent with spirit of the project, don’t you think?
With Applestuff or any other strong brand involved in the project, i think it’s the same thing.
My 2 cents :-)
Of course is not possibile to be 100% with opensource software, but the problem that i have noticed is concerned about the sposorship and the public donation of the project. If you guys uses Applestuff, this is a very big advertising for Apple, and i think people must know if there is some strong sponsorship. The challenge of this project, i think, is also to find a way to avoid using also full hardware branded system, otherwise you can, IE, make some corrections for the final movie with Discreet’s Inferno, but i think it’s not so coherent with spirit of the project, don’t you think?
With Applestuff or any other strong brand involved in the project, i think it’s the same thing.
My 2 cents :-)
Ops, sorry for double posting :-(
Jerry,
We ran into a problem with our setup, so in the interests of openness and sharing our problem solving process, I wrote about it here. The fact that we are using Apple gear in no way means that we are advertising for them. We are using it, that’s it. If we mention that we are also using Samsung monitors does that mean that we are advertising for them? No. We also have Wacom tablets here. Are we advertising for them? No. Of course, publically showing that Apple’s version of X11 doesn’t support a much needed feature is hardly good advertising for them anyway!
It’s a shame that you’re so worried about brands. If we only posted info like “we have a problem with XXXXXXX and we solved it by using a XXXXXXX to fix the XXXXXXX and reinstalled the XXXXXXX” then it wouldn’t be very useful information for the community, would it? :)
Cheers,
Matt
@Matt quote:” then it wouldn’t be very useful information for the community, would it? :)”
Of course:-)
I don’t say (and absolutely i don’t think that!) that you make advertising when you post comment on this blog!
The problem is that you (the crew) sayed that Macs has been the choise due to the discounted price obtained from Apple. Apple make the discounts not for the glory, i think, but because Apple thinks that he will get some cheap publicity on donating some stuff. And me, as a potential donator for the project, i don’t want to make publicity for Apple or any other brand with the donated money for the project.
I agree with you that it’s difficult (and maybe impossibile) to avoid to quote names or brands, but IMHO it’s a lot different to quote a things like “we have a problem with our samsung monitors, or Wacom Tablets, please help us” (as in your example), and “we will use Macs and his OS for the rest of the project for making texturing and a lot of other stuff”, and things like this.
It sounds not so cool, IMHO.
Anyway, i don’t want to be so polemic, i want to say that i like the project, your work, and your ideas! ;-)
Cheers
Seashore sounds promising but what about CinePaint’s native Macintosh port (http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/index.html)? I heard that CinePaint is great at handling large image files.
Conserning the some how futile Apple vs Open Source debate: I think it’s great that you Orange people use as many platforms as possible and are not so puristic.
“Hate to say: I use windows XP. I am to stupide for working fast on linux,I think.:)
Sorry I ask, but is there someone how knows something like Seashore for Windows XP.
I am looking for stuff to get the tablet pressure sensitivity working with Gimp for a long time, but still nothing!”
Nothing wrong with using Windows XP. You use what you have. Try: http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/paint.net/ for a nice opensource Windows application similar to Seashore.
Hi Matt,
What about Cinepaint on MacOSX?
Hi,
Cinepaint has the same problems – i.e. it runs via X11 which doesn’t send tablet events. The ‘native’ cinepaint that rose posted seem incredibly old and abandoned, and doesn’t seem to actually be available for download. Seashore is in active development (I’ve been in contact with the main developer) and already works great, so it’s a perfect choice for us :)
No Matt,
Cinepaint isn’t abandoned, i’ve seen activity on CVS and ML.
Maybe you can’t just get the binary for OSx.
Anyway, it won’t resolve the pressure problem.
cheers
ps: you could still install GNU/linux on your G4 station :p
Wow, mac bashers abound. I don’t see what all the fuss is about. Yes, it may be publicity for Apple but so what? When you mention Linux, it might mean more sales for distros that cost money or sites that earn money from advertising. Not forgetting that the hardware required to run Linux isn’t free. If you buy a PC, Linux comes free. If you buy a Mac, the system comes free too so you are in the same boat.
Changing the ppc to Linux is silly because then you have to get all the equivalent ppc binaries, not all of which exist.
Oh yeah and did we forget that project orange will use an Apple renderfarm?
Open source is great but sadly money makes the world go round. Until the open source community comes closer together, it will be hard for it to meet the demands of the commercial world. That’s why this project is important.
Blender is one of the few open source products that are actually usable in a production environment and even it has issues that this project will help to fix but you can’t expect the orange team to fix every open source app that isn’t good enough. If commercial products are used along the way, I don’t see the problem as long as the goal is reached in an efficient way.
Commercial products may even give some insight into what is missing from the open source apps.
Cinepaint binary for Mac is here btw:
http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/10739
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=75029&package_id=76680
but I doubt it will solve the pressure problem too. I hear Photoshop is real nice though :). Switching to it might give the GIMP developers some incentive to sort the problem out – people have been asking for ages.
Seashore looks OK but it seems to lack a lot of features (filters, clone stamp and things) and has that GIMP problem of always supplying bitmap brushes instead of vector ones so you always have to make your own.
Newsforge reports that GIMP 2.4 will have increased support for pressure sensitive airbrushing, and Mitch mentions that a Cocoa-port of GTK+ is on its way (with a screenshot of native GIMP running!).
Mac bashers, stay away :D
I admit – I have to use OS X in everyday’s work (coding in WebObjects) and, however, it is not without it’s own problems (no OS is perfect), it is quite a target for open source desktop devs to see what to achieve.
About tablet support – maybe instead of this just unpleasant to watch discussion (I thought that Open Source is about openess and freedom of choice right?), maybe instead of that get some tablet, testing it under Linux and GNOME/KDE, and try to solve those bugs and problems – test/bug reports with stack races would be just fine for bugzilla.
People, please don’t be total jerks and zealots. Yeah, I know, some people have gotten very jelous at OS X and afraid that it will drive power users away. No, OS X is good, but it has issues and Linux have lot of them already solved. All Linux needs is more of “just works” OS X karma. And YOU (bashers) can help it to happen! So just let’s do something good.
And finally, about Seashore – thanks! GIMP is rarerly usable trough X11 on OS X, as actually it lacks Cocoa integration (no blame on developers, it is how OS X is used to be). So I can at least have some of GIMP spell on my OS X desktop.
p.s. at home, I use Gentoo and no way I will go away from it.
and ohhh, thanks guys for Blender! You simply r o c k!
Seashore is still very early in its development cycle, and pretty much useless for any high end photo work as of yet, but keep your eye on it. Assuming the project isn’t abandoned in the near future, this app could have a future. Although, seriously, Seashore developers would do well to pay attention to professional designers and photographers. GIMP still doesn’t, and it shows in the app. Sorry Linux fans, but GIMP’s interface is not very well organized, its color-correction tools are rudimentary at best, and its color spaces are WAY off. That said, we’d all welcome an open-source alternative to Photoshop. GIMP just isn’t it. Let’s hope Seashore is.
Also, as a professional graphic designer of 15 years and filmmaker, I have to weigh in on the OS X bashing. I love Linux. I use it nearly every day. That said, it is sadly lacking in professional applications, and for every strength, there are 10 or 12 problems that the FOSS community needs to address before Linux is even mildly useful in my profession. To name a few, the hierarchy of libraries is a mess. The font and color handling is a disaster. And the desktop environments are more about skinability than reliability, predictability, and usability. Skins are cute, but thats about it.
I could, however, forgive Linux’s general lack of user-friendliness if the applications didn’t blow. Outside of Inkscape, there are very few viable professional grade apps. As much as anyone touts Cinelerra, its just not up to muster. Avid Xpress and Final Cut Pro dust Cinelerra for speed, reliability, and quality of output. And as much as I love Ardour, its pretty much a bare-bones audio workstation at present. GIMP and Scribus aren’t even on the same planet as Photoshop and InDesign. And Shake is faster, cheaper, and more reliable on OS X than Linux.
As much as I love Linux, if you aren’t web serving, data serving, or programming, it just isn’t up to snuff. But OS X is.
Oh yeah…I love Blender.
This is not a big problem.
It is best to use, as graph editor -Photoshop, but it’s is not a free :-(
All the things that Pakk99 has said are exactly describing the whole problem with OSS. Until recently, I only had a very old Photoshop 6 as well as Gimp and all the other OSS graphics apps. Then I got tired of waiting for new versions of the programs that support OS X (most of these came from the unavailability of GTK+ on OS X, which is now not an issue any more).
I bought me the educational version of Adobe Creative Suite. I was immediately blown away be the tight integration of the different apps. This integration is one of the things that Open-Source graphics software can hardly achieve, maybe with an equivalent to the Mozilla Foundation for graphics apps.
Well, I forgot: Blender is great, especially its real cross-platform support (not some crutch like X11). I haven’t worked with it that much, but from what I’ve seen, Blender is one of the few Open Source Apps that are on par with their commercial counterparts.
The Orange project is, I think, a great thing as well, making Blender ready for professional production in the best possible way (with some eye candy emerging along the way).
I’ll have to get in on this a little… I’ve been working in the Fine Arts and Graphic Design for a great chunk of my life…. Weighing the performance of the applications that people suggest… and some that i hunt out myself, I often find that comparatively, the Opensource community fights too often, or sometimes belittle the thoughts of endusers… or………. with much dispassion, work against being compared to commercial projects. I don’t agree that commercial projects have everything worked out, yet, there are things to consider. I’ve mentioned to some developers issues i’ve had with thier GUI’s and was blasted! This one is so modular or that one is so non technical… forgetting that the user’s interest is…. well, it’s use. Again, the commercial people don’t have this down either…. but, to make money, you have to please more people. Their problem is they get so broad that they often don’t listen to one or two voices.. unless it comes from the top. While smaller operations listen to those one or two voices and bar the reasoning of the masses.
Seashore, at least seems to try to make an effort to keep balance. There’s another ‘free’ cocoa image editor that in some ways runs circles around Seashore. But, Seashore’s connection to Gimp and the Gimp community… QUICKLY quiets any competitive edge there. Chocoflop will probably, be greater as a stand alone app by the end of the year unless Seashore makes more use of Core Image or the Open Source community gets more involved with a project like this! I’ve seen challenges to seashore, saying that it will weaken the focus on Gimp……. not likely, but i think more filters, brushes, effects, blah blah blah… from the Community might aid in its maturity……
Hope you can draw a little from this…Sleep deprivation can haunt an artist’s daily functioning… ah, but the glow of the lcd screen keeps me going… oh look the sun is out too…. i can push another hour .. yes… especially, knowing that this link has been made… Seashore and Blender… finally…. finally…maybe now.. i can rest.